Saul Silas Fathi Transcript (2)
March 22, 2008 | Leave a Comment
Dr. Kent Gustavson: Welcome back to Sound Authors. We have been speaking with Saul Silas Fathi, and his book is called “Full Circle: Escape from Baghdad and the Return”. I guess what I am interested in chatting about now is, I guess, the future and where we sit right now.The Middle East is such a mess right now, the Israel-Palestinian conflict, the Iraq conflict, clearly Iran is a mess. Tell me a little bit about your take on all of this.
Saul Silas Fathi: Well, I supported Bush in trying to get rid of Saddam Hussein. Because he felt that the Iraqi people deserved better. But, I was totally opposed to invading Iraq, especially the way we did it. I felt we went to destroy a regime. We ended up destroying a 6,000 year old civilization. So in that it was very sad to see what happened to the Iraqi people. In five years, according to some reports, 800,000 Iraqi people, including 50,000 children, died.The very premise of bringing democracy to an Arab country was completely based on falsehood and ignorance. There are 22 Arab countries, none of them are democratic. And none of them were elected by the people and probably never will. Among our biggest allies are some of those dictatorships and so forth. So this was totally uncalled for.But, at the same time it is realistic to know that we cannot leave Iraq before we’ve fixed it, before we’ve built its power again. Because we dismissed the army of 300,000, sent them home, created 50% unemployment and terrible destitution. For the first time in the 6,000 year history the Iraqi people have no drinking water to drink, and 60% of the people have no electricity.And unemployment is still, in certain places, over 60%. And this is what causes the most misery in Iraq. It is not any loyalty to Saddam. These people are just trying to feed their families, and that is why they were in the armed forces but they were punished collectively. I think that was the most colossal mistake that we made is dismissing the army.If we did not dismiss the army, but purged it. With maybe 15 or 20,000 people we would have been left with enough power, enough organization to govern and police the country and supplement it by just a few of our forces.But, now that we are in there our long-term interest is intertwined with the future of Iraq. If we move out prematurely there is absolutely no question in my mind that the Iranians will take over de facto of Iraq, and that is the dream that they have been dreaming for thousands of years of doing.The idea that the Sunnis and the Shiite were fighting between them for thousands of years is a total falsehood, total misrepresentation of real history. For 1400 years after Mohammed’s death there were no conflicts, no killing and absolutely no bombing or burning of any of the opposition’s mosques for 1400 years.Everything was settled during the first hundred years after Mohammed’s death, and the Shiite moved from Arabia to Iraq and built two magnificent little cities, called Najaf and Karbala. This is where the leadership got assassinated eventually, Ali and Hasan. And they became like a Mecca to the Shiite people. So there were approximately 100,000 pilgrims coming through Iran every year into Iraq to worship and to pray and so forth and so on.The notion that was perpetuated here that these people have been fighting and we came in to make peace between them, all of that is a total, total falsehood. I lecture on that extensively, by the way. I am a scholar in Islam, and I lecture about the history of Islam and the Middle East.
Kent: Such a tragedy when you say 800,000 people, and I have heard similar figures from the Citizens for Social Responsibility. We hear about it so seldom in the media, and I find that a very painful reality.
Saul: That is a point of contention that I have all the time with the media especially CNN. Nobody wants to hear it. Nobody wants to know the facts, and they often time are just ignorant. They are not misleading on purpose; they are just ignorant of the facts. They send reporters and the reporters end up in the Green Zone. How can you report about a country with a 6,000 year civilization by staying in the Green Zone?I have not seen one Iraqi family at dinner sitting with a reporter and having dinner with the children and asking some nice questions. I have not seen one that shows the two great rivers of Iraq and with the boats going through it and with all of the millions and millions of palm trees lined up in the streets and on the beaches and so forth. All you see is killing and murder and bloodshed. This is not Iraq; it never was.Unfortunately, I can tell you - some people think I have a bleak outlook - I think it will never settle and it will never go back to normal until another one just like Saddam emerges.
Kent: Wow. This is a fascinating discussion, and surely I could listen to you for hours about Iraq. I would like to ask also about Israel and Palestine. This situation never seems to end. It started in ‘48. It has been going on for a hundred plus years, you know.There was that rush to see who could get more people in there to see who would claim statehood back in the ’40s. Tell me what you think. Where does this history resolve? Is its ever going to happen?
Saul: It definitely is not going to happen on Bush’s clock. As he intended for this year. He said he will go back in six months and have peace between the two factions and that the Palestinians have their own country. As long as the Palestinians are in the grip of Hamas and people like Hamas and Hezbollah and such, and supported by states like Iran and so forth, I don’t believe it will ever happen.I don’t believe that there will be peace or that a country, a Palestinian country will be established. When two countries want to live together and two people want to live together, they have to make peace and they have to, in their heart, allow for the existence of the other. That has not happened, because they are taught hatred in their schools and Madrasas around the world.If I may say so as well, when Bush spoke about the “axis of evil,” he left out the two most important members of that axis and that is Saudi Arabia and Pakistan. They are the ones who finance all the terrorism in the world. They are the ones, more than Iran, more than Iraq ever did and certainly more than North Korea ever did. They should have been included in that speech.
Kent: So your book is called “Full Circle: Escape from Baghdad and the Return.” How much do you get into where we are today?
Saul: I don’t really do that except for the first 10 chapters, where I speak about Iraq and everything. But then later on, I concentrate strictly on my life and where it took me on my search, which seems to be a lifetime search for meaning and my position in the world.
Kent: And your lif…
Saul: There’s a lot of reflection back and forth and there’s fond memories that are brought up at many different junctures. I lived in Brazil as well and then I served in the US army and I ended up in Korea with the first calv. So I paid my price several times over.
Kent: You talk about in your book, in that crucial chapter when you escape from Baghdad and earlier you talk about having witnessed to hanging as a small boy. It seems that your very interesting views about war in the world and things that I’ve not heard before. How did it shape you to witness that event?
Saul: It absolutely shaped my life and there were several such occurrences that are depicted in the book, especially the escape and what happened to one of the babies escaping with us. My father, when I was nine years old and he was in hiding… No, he was not in hiding yet, but he was expecting for several months for his name to be on a black list in the newspapers.He continued to work and so forth, but he was so afraid things will start happening. What they were trying to do to appease the high level military, who threatened to do a coup, which they attempted many, many times, especially in 1941. To appease them and to appease the guy on the street, the ignorant, uneducated people. They decided to blame everything on the Jews and on Zionism.So they began making lists of prominent Jews, some of the wealthiest and some of the most important in government. And either arrest them, torture them or hand them publicly. So, there came a point when I was nine years old, where a friend of the family who was a distant relative, was accused of being a communist and a Zionist.Which is the way they always accused the Jews because that would get the most mileage out of the Arabs, being anti-communist and anti-Zionism. They hanged them. My father decided to take me to view the hanging in public. My mother protested very much, but she had no power. He convinced her that I have to grow up quickly, not to lead a normal child’s life. This will do it.So, on the way there, he told me not to show any emotion and not to cry, just watch and leave all the emotions and the burst when we get home. This was a very terrible experience for me. Before they hanged him, they told him to recant and that his life would be spared if he admits to the charges of being a Zionist and a communist.And being young guy, 23 years old, he was really falling apart. They were holding him to support him. He agreed and he said, OK, I confess. They went ahead and they hanged him anyway.
Kent: Oh, my.
Saul: The public threw tomatoes and eggs on him and so forth while he was hanging. And he was left hanging for two days in a public place before them. So that the thousands of throngs of people would have a chance to witness it.
Kent: What a horrible experience for a child.
Saul: Yes, this was terrible.
Kent: This has been a fascinating discussion. I could talk to you for hours. The book is called “Full Circle: Escape from Baghdad and the Return.” We’re definitely thinking about the Middle East right now. This is a wonderful introduction to the true reality of Iraq, before all this happened. And also of Israel and at the beginnings of Israel.Thank you so much for being on the show.
Saul: Thank you, Dr. Kent. And may I please tell the audience where they could find the story on the Internet?
Kent: Absolutely.
Saul: www and my name saulsilasfathi.com.
Kent: And that’s spelled S-A-U-L, Saul, Silas, S-I-L-A-S, and Fathi, F-A-T-H-I dot com.
Saul: Correct. And the escape story is there, which they can read or download or print or whatever.
Kent: And the book is available through stores as well?
Saul: Yes, yes.
Kent: ”Full Circle: Escape from Baghdad and the Return.” Saul Silas Fathi, thank you so much for being on the show.
Saul: Thank you, Dr. Kent.
Kent: My next guest is Jessica Kizorek. We’ll be back in a second.
Saul Silas Fathi Transcript
March 22, 2008 | Leave a Comment
Dr. Kent Gustavson: Welcome to Sound Authors. On the show today we’ve got some interesting guests. A musical legend at the end, Little Jimmy Scott, will be on the show. My first guest will be Saul Silas Fathi. He’s a Jewish man who was born in Baghdad and will speak about his struggles in his book. My second guest will be Jessica Kizorek, and she’ll be speaking to us about charity and video production and her new book as well.It’s a beautiful day here in New York–windy, sunny. I’d like to welcome my first guest to the show. He was born to a prominent Jewish family in Baghdad way back in 1938. At age 10 he was smuggled out of Baghdad through Iran and he ended up in Israel. He began writing a diary at age 11. Now he has written this book about his life. Welcome to the show.
Saul Silas Fathi: Thank you.
Dr. Kent: I have quite a bit of background in Middle East history and all of that. Nineteen forty-eight was a pretty intense year. Tell me the story of your life since 1948.
Saul: Well, I was born in 1938, 10 years earlier, in Baghdad to a prominent Jewish family. My father, unlike many other Jews that lived in Iraq for 2,600 years, was not a merchant and was not an independent businessman. He was a high government official. He actually was in charge of developing the railroad systems in Iraq. That appointment came in the late ’20s when he got a scholarship to go to Bombay University by the British. Then the British brought him back to do that.So I was born and lived in a very exclusive neighborhood where two prime ministers of Iraq lived. We played with their kids. We grew up together. We had a near-idyllic life.This would change drastically as Zionism grew and as the prospect for a Jewish state in Palestine grew. The hatred became fomented, especially among the military. Ten years earlier, “Mein Kampf,” the book that Hitler wrote, became translated into about 30 languages and among them was Arabic. There were over 200 million Arabic-speaking people in the Middle East who latched on to that and began blaming the Jews for their misery and for their plight and whatever. Things changed to the point where they had to all be expelled in 1951.In 1948, when the war was raging between Israel and the Arab countries, things got to be very, very untenable. My father was placed on a list of prominent Jews in Iraq to be hanged. He went into hiding and decided to save at least two of his eight children. That was me and my younger brother, who was eight and a half. I was ten.
Dr. Kent: What happened to the rest of your siblings?
Saul: They came in 1951, when King Faisal II allowed the Jews to leave Iraq forever and go to Israel or to any other country that would take them. At that time, my parents substituted me and my brother with two orphan kids that they adopted in order to present the proper credentials. They left Iraq and came to Israel and found us in the kibbutz–myself and my brother.
Dr. Kent: So the two of you actually lived without your parents for some years.
Saul: We lived without our parents and without any contact with them, and also without them knowing whether we made it alive or not, for two years.
Dr. Kent: The kibbutz system itself is very communal. Did they accept you well as family members?
Fathi: It was an excellent communal life. Kibbutz is the most communistic environment you can think of. In other words, the community takes care of its people and you just contribute whatever you can. So being a 10-year-old, we studied for six hours a day and worked in the field for two hours a day. We were accepted because there were Jews from all the Holocaust countries in Europe that had arrived at the same kibbutz. We were divided about 20 or 30 children in a group and put in many different kibbutzim within Israel.
Dr. Kent: I know that time was so interesting in Israel because people were coming from all over the world. They talk about a tent city outside Jerusalem. Can you describe what it was like?
Saul: It was really a terrible difficulty, but especially for the grown-ups. For the young people, we had nothing but what you might call fun adopting. We learned the language and we learned to dance. We learned the horah and we learned the magnificent songs of Israel, which were mostly Russian by origin, translated into Hebrew because many of the Jews in Israel that came before the war were kind of socialist in mind.It was beautiful to be cared for and totally taken care of in terms of security. Not to be afraid ever of being challenged in the street or near the school or threatened with your life and so forth and so on. To us it was great. For my father and people like him it was a terrible transition. They lived in tents in desert-like environments. They had no money. They had nothing. They had left everything back there. They were in mud up to the knees.My father had no job and he had to support eight children for two years and got very sick and hospitalized and so forth. So, he went through absolute hell, but he was a true Zionist in his heart. He knew that this is a new phase that we have to live through. He never complained in his life. And then he ended up working in the Israeli Air Force, when they finally discovered his credentials and his talents, and worked there for 20 years until his retirement.
Dr. Kent: Have you ever been back to Iraq?
Saul: I’ve never been back to Iraq. Of course, I’ve been back to Israel many, many times. But since September 11, I have tried at least a dozen times to get a visa, and I was blocked by the American State Department.
Dr. Kent: What are your recollections of Baghdad? It was surely different back in the ’40s.
Saul: It was a near-idyllic life for us children, especially my father’s position. I had many, many high-level friends, both Arabs, Muslims and Christians, and some Kurds and so forth.My father had lived a typical middle-class and high-class citizen of Iraq in that he was like a king in the house. He would come in every day with a chauffeured car, a government car, and would wash up and go out for the night nightclubbing. He would be with his friends and so forth.Only once a month he would take us along, the entire family with him. We children were involved in flying pigeons and kites and all kinds of games, swimming in the magnificent rivers of Baghdad, and going to the Baghdad Museum, which was walking distance from our house.By the way, my house and that entire neighborhood is now part of the Green Zone where everybody visits when they visit Iraq. It’s the safe zone.
Dr. Kent: I’ve heard a lot about the museums. There was a good amount of looting after, I believe…
Saul: That was one of the terrible mistakes in American logistics. Yes, that was very painful even for me, because I have such memories of that. My father used to take us on the weekend, walk over there, explain things to us, show us items 70,000 years old. He would talk to us about the Babylonian civilization, what they went through and what they contributed to society and to civilization, what have you.
Dr. Kent: Were you allowed to be openly Jewish at that stage?
Saul: Absolutely allowed. Not only allowed, but we thrived there. The Jewish community in Iraq is the oldest Jewish community on the face of the Earth. It goes back all the way to the First Destruction of the Temple 2,650 years ago.Not only they lived there, but they were there much, much before Islam. Thousands of years before Islam. So, they had adopted to whoever conquered Babylonia and Mesopotamia and so forth. They went through many different names, but the Jews were always a group of people who were appreciated for their learning, and for their ambition to get ahead and to teach their kids and do trades for the world, and so forth and so on.They were absolutely welcome and accepted, and even loved in many quarters, until the prospects of the Israeli state came about.
Dr. Kent: Wouldn’t it be nice if both Israel with the Palestinians and Iraq with our occupation and all that, and Iran, if we could find that kind of cooperation these days?
Saul: It would be absolutely wonderful and a blessing to all involved.
Dr. Kent: So, tell us about your book, “Full Circle: Escape from Baghdad and the Return.” Is it full of stories like this?
Saul: Yes, it’s full of stories. There are 10 chapters on my first 10 years in Iraq, which I think is an amazing amount of material. I have removed a lot of material to reduce the size of the book, also.But there are ten chapters, nine of them talking about the idyllic life that we lived, dispelling a lot of the myths that circulate in the media and so forth about Jewish life in Arab countries. The last chapter, Chapter 10, is the escape, which is a harrowing experience that took us six months to just move about 500 miles from Iraq through Iran and into Israel.
Dr. Kent: How did you get from Iran to Israel?
Saul: By plane, but the Shah of Iran was very friendly with the notion of Israel and the Jewish state, and also had his own Jewish minority within Iran. The Shah was a Muslim, but he was not considered an Arab. They have their own civilization, which is also magnificent in history.He was sympathetic, so what happened is, my father arranged through the underground to smuggle me and my brother with a group of 18 other people into Iran. From Iran we went by railroad to Tehran, where he had a camp. In that camp he concentrated all the Jewish boys that escaped the Holocaust in Europe, and other people like myself from Syria and Lebanon and the other Arab countries, as well as from Greece and Turkey and so forth.Whenever there was enough for a plane load through the Mossad and some other organizations, they arranged for a constellation to come in and pick us up, and that’s how we ended up in Israel.
Dr. Kent: We’ll come back in one section and hear some more stories from Saul Silas Fathi, a boy who grew up in Baghdad, went through Israel, and is now in the United States. His book is “Full Circle: Escape from Baghdad and the Return.” We’ll talk to you again in a second.
Saul: Thank you.
Jimmy Scott | Jazz Legend
March 21, 2008 | Leave a Comment
Today, we spoke with Jimmy Scott, jazz legend, with his sweet, soulful, honey-throated songs of love, blues and much more…More information about Jimmy Scott from Wikipedia:
Jimmy Scott (July 17, 1925 in Cleveland) is an American jazz vocalist.
Scott has Kallmann’s syndrome, a genetic condition which stunted his growth at five feet and prevented him reaching puberty, leaving him with a high, undeveloped soprano voice, hence his nickname “Little” Jimmy Scott.However, it was his extraordinary phrasing and romantic feeling that made him a favorite singer of fellow artists like Billie Holiday, Ray Charles, Dinah Washington, and Nancy Wilson.Scott was born in Cleveland, Ohio to Authur and Justine Stanard Scott, third in a family of ten. As a child he got his first singing experience by his mother’s side at the family piano, and later, in church choir. His father was absent most of the time as he was taken with drink, gambling, and other women. Jimmy worshipped his mother, and whatever money he could make doing odd-jobs, went to her to help the family. At thirteen, he was orphaned when his mother was killed by a drunk driver. Witnesses say that she pushed one of Jimmy’s siblings out of the way of the car, but in the process of saving her child’s life, she lost her own.Scott first rose to national prominence as “Little Jimmy Scott” in the Lionel Hampton Band when he sang lead on the late 1940s hit “Everybody’s Somebody’s Fool“. Credit on the label, however, went to ‘male vocalist’, a slight to his talent and a blow to his career. A blow which would reoccur several years later, when his vocal on “Embraceable You” with Charlie Parker on the album, “One Night in Birdland” was credited to female vocalist, Chubby Newsome.In 1963, it looked as though Scott’s luck had changed for the good. Signed to Ray Charles’s Tangerine label, he recorded under the supervision of the great man himself, what is by many considered as one of the great jazz vocal albums of all time, Falling in Love is Wonderful. The record was yanked from the shelves in a matter of days while Jimmy was honeymooning due to a contract he had signed earlier with Herman Lubinsky. (Only 40 years later this cult album became available to the big public again!). Another masterpiece, the album The Source (1969), where he sings intense as ever, was not permitted to be released, (until 2001).Scott’s career faded by the late 1960s and he returned to his native Cleveland to work in a hospital and as an elevator operator in a hotel.He resurfaced in 1991 when he sang at the funeral of his long-time friend Doc Pomus. Afterwards Lou Reed recruited him to sing back-up on the track “Power and Glory” on his 1992 album Magic and Loss, partially inspired by Pomus’ death. Afterwards, Scott was seen on the series finale of David Lynch’s show Twin Peaks, singing “Sycamore Trees.” He was featured on the soundtrack of the follow-up film Fire Walk With Me. This brought him to the attention of the music industry and he has enjoyed significant success since then, singing and recording.His comeback took off in earnest with the 1992 release of the album “All The Way” on Sire Records, produced by Tommy Lipuma and featuring artists such as Kenny Barron, Ron Carter, and David “Fathead” Newman. Jimmy Scott was nominated for a Grammy Award for this album.He followed this up with the album “Dream” in 1994, and the jazz-gospel album “Heaven” in 1996. He also recorded an album of mostly pop and rock covers, “Holding Back the Years” in 1998. In 1999, his early recordings on the Decca label were re-released on CD, as were all of his recordings with the Savoy Label between 1952 and 1975 in a 3 disc Box Set. In 2000, Jimmy Scott was signed to the Milestone jazz label, and recorded four critically acclaimed albums, each produced by Todd Barkan, and featuring a variety of jazz artists, including as Wynton Marsalis, Renee Rosnes, Bob Kindred, Eric Alexander, Lew Soloff, George Mraz, Lewis Nash, and many more, as well as Jimmy’s own touring and recording band “The Jazz Expressions”. He also released two live albums, both recorded in Japan, and featuring the Jazz Expressions.Jimmy Scott’s career has spanned nearly sixty years, and in that time he has performed with a list of artists that read like a history of jazz music in that time, including Charlie Parker, Sarah Vaughan, Lester Young, Lionel Hampton, Charles Mingus, Fats Navarro, Bud Powell, Ray Charles, Wynton Marsalis, and Peter Cincotti. He has also performed with a host of musicians from other genres of music, such as David Byrne, Lou Reed, Flea, Michael Stipe, and Antony & The Johnsons.Most recently he has appeared in live performances with Pink Martini, and continues to perform to audiences internationally at music festivals and at his own concerts.In 2007 Jimmy Scott received the 2007 National Endowment Jazz Master Award.Mr Scott lives in New Jersey, with his wife Jeannie. He appears to have moved to Las Vegas in 2007.
Jessica Kizorek | Show Me the Book
March 21, 2008 | Leave a Comment
We spoke with Jessica Kizorek today, an expert in online video marketing, and well-known in the world as a non-profit storyteller.More on Jessica Kizorek from her website: www.showmethebook.com:
An industry speaker on the subject of video marketing and the Internet, Jessica Kizorek was recently featured on CNN’s series “Young People Who Rock,” for her passion in documenting the impact of humanitarian efforts around the globe. Her production company, Two Parrot Productions, has spotlighted NGOs in Africa, Asia, Eastern Europe and the Middle East.
Jessica’s experience as a Producer/Director played into her new book, “Show Me: Marketing with Video on the Internet,” which has already received impressive reviews from marketing professionals. The book, was released on January 17th in both hardcover and paperback, draws from exclusive interviews with over 60 of the nation’s top advertising executives.She graduated Magna Cum Laude and Phi Beta Kappa, from the University of Colorado, and is a Gold Medal winner of the Vision Awards for Excellence in Video Production.To view Jessica’s CNN interview: www.TwoParrot.com/cnn
Saul Silas Fathi | Refugee Child from Baghdad
March 21, 2008 | Leave a Comment
This is the second part of an interview with Saul Silas Fathi, who emigrated to Israel in 1948 after an escape from Baghdad Iraq. For more about Saul Silas Fathi and his extraordinary tale, go to his website: www.saulsilasfathi.comMore about Saul Silas Fathi from his website:
Saul Silas Fathi was born to a prominent Jewish family in Baghdad, Iraq, on May 8, 1938. At age 10, he and his younger brother were smuggled out of Baghdad through Iran and eventually reached the newly formed state of Israel. He began writing a diary at age 11 and had several stories published in Israeli youth magazines.Saul enrolled at the Israel Airforce Academy of Aeronautics, a 4-year program, where he earned his high-school diploma and became certified in electrical engineering. In 1958, he worked his way to Brazil where he nearly starved. Through perseverance and luck, he started his own electrical business and earned a patent for climate-controlled windows used in the building of Brasilia, Brazil.In 1960, he came to the U.S. on a student exchange visa, studying sculpture at the Brooklyn Museum of Art and American history and public speaking at the New School of Social Studies. After 8 months, Saul volunteered to serve in the U.S. Army for three years, having been promised a college education and U.S. citizenship at the conclusion of his duties. After Basic Training in Fort Benning, Georgia, he was sent to helicopter school at Fort Bragg, North Carolina, and there enrolled at the University Of Virginia. Within a few months, Saul was shipped to South Korea where he served as Chief Electrical Technician with the 1st Cavalry Division, 15th Aviation Company, the famed helicopter division in the Vietnam War.Back in the U.S., Saul battled the immigration department while studying at the University of Virginia, finally earning a Bachelor of Science degree in electrical engineering. This launched an impressive career as a high-level executive with several Fortune-500 companies. Later, he founded and managed three high-tech companies of his own over a 20-year period.Saul retired in 2003 and began writing his memoirs, Full Circle: Escape from Baghdad and the Return. Today, he lives in Long Island, New York, with his wife Rachelle and has three U.S.-born daughters and two grandchildren. He is also a certified linguist, fluent in English, Hebrew, Arabic, and Portuguese.


























